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	<title>Comments for Ishango Bones</title>
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	<link>http://ishangobones.com</link>
	<description>Contemplation, spiritual wonder and spontaneous awe</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 30 Aug 2010 10:40:05 -0700</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on You are a magnet by movies</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=618&#038;cpage=1#comment-706</link>
		<dc:creator>movies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Aug 2010 10:40:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=618#comment-706</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt; juice http://yjuicer-zi.01DODGEPARTS.US/tag/tv+movies+juice/ : tv...&lt;/strong&gt;

juice...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong> juice <a href="http://yjuicer-zi.01DODGEPARTS.US/tag/tv+movies+juice/" rel="nofollow">http://yjuicer-zi.01DODGEPARTS.US/tag/tv+movies+juice/</a> : tv&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>juice&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Unlikely Happiness by Dad</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=730&#038;cpage=1#comment-155</link>
		<dc:creator>Dad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 May 2010 12:56:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=730#comment-155</guid>
		<description>A wonderful piece of writing!  Not only well written, but deeply insightful into the contemplative Christian spirituality of our daily lives.  A keen mix of Merton&#039;s contemplative spirituality and St Francis de Sales&#039; spirituality of the here and now of our lives.

Well done!  A mature and readable style that shows a professionalism makes this an enjoyable read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A wonderful piece of writing!  Not only well written, but deeply insightful into the contemplative Christian spirituality of our daily lives.  A keen mix of Merton&#8217;s contemplative spirituality and St Francis de Sales&#8217; spirituality of the here and now of our lives.</p>
<p>Well done!  A mature and readable style that shows a professionalism makes this an enjoyable read.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Unlikely Happiness by Nancy Trahan</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=730&#038;cpage=1#comment-151</link>
		<dc:creator>Nancy Trahan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 May 2010 23:02:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=730#comment-151</guid>
		<description>I loved this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I loved this.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Perfect Joy by peter</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=681&#038;cpage=1#comment-82</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Apr 2010 12:48:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=681#comment-82</guid>
		<description>Here is another way to put it:

Music and Life

    * “In music, one doesn’t make the end of the composition the point of the composition.”
    * We are motivated by the carrots of grades and success. Elementary &gt; Grade School &gt; High School &gt; College &gt; Grad School &gt; Job &gt; Success
    * When you “get” success at 40, it’s a let-down. A hoax.
    * We think of life as a journey with a destination (success, heaven). But we missed the point. It was a musical thing, we were supposed to sing and dance while music was being played.

found at betterexplained.com:

http://www.neticons.net/music_life/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is another way to put it:</p>
<p>Music and Life</p>
<p>    * “In music, one doesn’t make the end of the composition the point of the composition.”<br />
    * We are motivated by the carrots of grades and success. Elementary > Grade School > High School > College > Grad School > Job > Success<br />
    * When you “get” success at 40, it’s a let-down. A hoax.<br />
    * We think of life as a journey with a destination (success, heaven). But we missed the point. It was a musical thing, we were supposed to sing and dance while music was being played.</p>
<p>found at betterexplained.com:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.neticons.net/music_life/" rel="nofollow">http://www.neticons.net/music_life/</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on Perfect Joy by peter</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=681&#038;cpage=1#comment-76</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Mar 2010 13:45:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=681#comment-76</guid>
		<description>In ancient Taoist texts, wu wei is associated with water through its yielding nature.[27] Water is soft and weak, but it can move earth and carve stone. Taoist philosophy proposes that the universe works harmoniously according to its own ways. When someone exerts his will against the world, he disrupts that harmony. Taoism does not identify man&#039;s will as the root problem. Rather, it asserts that man must place his will in harmony with the natural universe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taoism#Wu_wei</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In ancient Taoist texts, wu wei is associated with water through its yielding nature.[27] Water is soft and weak, but it can move earth and carve stone. Taoist philosophy proposes that the universe works harmoniously according to its own ways. When someone exerts his will against the world, he disrupts that harmony. Taoism does not identify man&#8217;s will as the root problem. Rather, it asserts that man must place his will in harmony with the natural universe</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taoism#Wu_wei" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taoism#Wu_wei</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on Perfect Joy by peter</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=681&#038;cpage=1#comment-75</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Mar 2010 13:33:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=681#comment-75</guid>
		<description>There are many ways in which I agree with you. There is a sense in which being driftwood does not make sense - at least not as a strategy. And there is a sense in which the struggle is what it is about.

For sure. Absolutely.

But let&#039;s be specific. Because there is also the ability to experience perfect joy in a traffic jam. The question is, where does this ability come from?

What Merton is suggesting is that this perfect joy does not come from the outside. It does not come from accomplishment, achievement, or any other &quot;acquiring,&quot; whether of money, power, or status.

But it &lt;em&gt;is &lt;/em&gt;a struggle to achieve this state of perfect joy. It means staying centered and grounded in the essence of your pure being, which is not affected by circumstance. 

Also, what Merton is describing is not &quot;fate.&quot; This is not about fate, or becoming driftwood. It is about where true, lasting happiness comes from. Merton is simply pointing out that it cannot be obtained from the outside. Once this truth is realized, and once happiness is truly found, nothing in the outside world can remove it.

So no, sitting around all day, drinking beer will not make you any happier than money, power, and a successful career. But once you rest in perfect happiness, you may find that you no longer feel the urge to go out and struggle for the things you once thought worth struggling for.

So there is a struggle that is worth the effort. But the person who attains the career status and success they have struggled for, can lose it at any moment at the whim of the economy. If your happiness is swept away by this, then I would say you picked the wrong struggle. 

To be able to be happy where you are means nothing can take away your happiness. This is a deep spiritual expertise few reach, but it is a worthy goal. And it is here that the driftwood metaphor (a description of Taoism, by the way) starts to make sense - not as a &lt;em&gt;method &lt;/em&gt;of obtaining happiness, but as a &lt;em&gt;result &lt;/em&gt;of having already obtained happiness.

I am not against careerism per se. Do what you love. Live your passion. Chase your dream. But don&#039;t do it as a means to some other end. Do all things for their own sake. It sounds cliche and simple, but how few of us actually do this? When we look, we find that we are chasing status, power, money &lt;em&gt;instead of&lt;/em&gt; happiness. This is the real danger.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are many ways in which I agree with you. There is a sense in which being driftwood does not make sense &#8211; at least not as a strategy. And there is a sense in which the struggle is what it is about.</p>
<p>For sure. Absolutely.</p>
<p>But let&#8217;s be specific. Because there is also the ability to experience perfect joy in a traffic jam. The question is, where does this ability come from?</p>
<p>What Merton is suggesting is that this perfect joy does not come from the outside. It does not come from accomplishment, achievement, or any other &#8220;acquiring,&#8221; whether of money, power, or status.</p>
<p>But it <em>is </em>a struggle to achieve this state of perfect joy. It means staying centered and grounded in the essence of your pure being, which is not affected by circumstance. </p>
<p>Also, what Merton is describing is not &#8220;fate.&#8221; This is not about fate, or becoming driftwood. It is about where true, lasting happiness comes from. Merton is simply pointing out that it cannot be obtained from the outside. Once this truth is realized, and once happiness is truly found, nothing in the outside world can remove it.</p>
<p>So no, sitting around all day, drinking beer will not make you any happier than money, power, and a successful career. But once you rest in perfect happiness, you may find that you no longer feel the urge to go out and struggle for the things you once thought worth struggling for.</p>
<p>So there is a struggle that is worth the effort. But the person who attains the career status and success they have struggled for, can lose it at any moment at the whim of the economy. If your happiness is swept away by this, then I would say you picked the wrong struggle. </p>
<p>To be able to be happy where you are means nothing can take away your happiness. This is a deep spiritual expertise few reach, but it is a worthy goal. And it is here that the driftwood metaphor (a description of Taoism, by the way) starts to make sense &#8211; not as a <em>method </em>of obtaining happiness, but as a <em>result </em>of having already obtained happiness.</p>
<p>I am not against careerism per se. Do what you love. Live your passion. Chase your dream. But don&#8217;t do it as a means to some other end. Do all things for their own sake. It sounds cliche and simple, but how few of us actually do this? When we look, we find that we are chasing status, power, money <em>instead of</em> happiness. This is the real danger.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Perfect Joy by freemariner</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=681&#038;cpage=1#comment-74</link>
		<dc:creator>freemariner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Mar 2010 13:10:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=681#comment-74</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think we are supposed to just be pieces of driftwood letting the current take us wherever. If fate is how the world works then I&#039;m going to stay at home all day, drink beer, and eat potato chips. That would definitely make me happy. At least for a while. 

Maybe the struggle IS what it&#039;s about. We&#039;re supposed to bitch and complain. And figure it out, then bitch and complain some more. Maybe there&#039;s some wisdom in that. At least that&#039;s what I have to tell myself that lately!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think we are supposed to just be pieces of driftwood letting the current take us wherever. If fate is how the world works then I&#8217;m going to stay at home all day, drink beer, and eat potato chips. That would definitely make me happy. At least for a while. </p>
<p>Maybe the struggle IS what it&#8217;s about. We&#8217;re supposed to bitch and complain. And figure it out, then bitch and complain some more. Maybe there&#8217;s some wisdom in that. At least that&#8217;s what I have to tell myself that lately!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Heat and Light by Energy &#171; Ishango Bones</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=509&#038;cpage=1#comment-61</link>
		<dc:creator>Energy &#171; Ishango Bones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 02:14:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=509#comment-61</guid>
		<description>[...] the atoms of the floor? Because we can measure the fact that the floor got hotter, and we know that heat is a mechanism by which motion is transferred from one object to another. and that temperature, as the average amount of heat in a body, tells us how fast or slow &#8211; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the atoms of the floor? Because we can measure the fact that the floor got hotter, and we know that heat is a mechanism by which motion is transferred from one object to another. and that temperature, as the average amount of heat in a body, tells us how fast or slow &#8211; [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Intuition Failure by peter</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=620&#038;cpage=1#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Feb 2010 23:45:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=620#comment-50</guid>
		<description>What we have here is basically a semantic problem. I call it the category mistake, though I am not sure if that is literally accurate (there is a specific meaning to what philosophers refer to as a category mistake and I am not sure if I am using it exactly in the right way, but in spirit, it captures the essence of the problem).

From Alice in Wonderland:

--snip--
What can you see on the road?

Nothing.

What great eyesight! What does nothing look like?
--snip--

In these cases, we have not revealed some mystical truth or problem with the universe, we have simply made a semantic error with the usage and application of our nouns. We misinterpret or mis-state what we denote. We ask, what color is 42, what is the next real number, or we speak of an &quot;infinite quantity&quot; all of which are simply undefined. The reason we have trouble seeing that these latter examples are undefined is because we have obfuscated the facts of what we are denoting..

Here is how we get there:

First we are shown a picture of 2 apples (a map of a concrete thing) then 3 more apples and now we see that we have 5 apples. Then we are given another &quot;map&quot; that corresponds to the map (picture) of the apples. Now we see numerals next to the pictures of our apples. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5... then we get rid of the pictures of apples and deal only with our numerals (our map of a map), and with this image of an image of something concrete we slowly start to think of these numerals in the same concrete way we think of apples. We think now of the &quot;number 5&quot; in a very concrete way. 

How thoroughly we have tricked ourselves! Eventually, we are unable to understand the difference between &quot;map-ness&quot; and &quot;concrete-ness&quot; altogether. Or, if we can understand it, we yet do not &quot;see&quot; this difference when we think of &quot;a number.&quot;

Furthermore, it is always in this way that we move from the concrete, &quot;up&quot; to the abstract level, and then bring the abstract back &quot;down&quot; to the concrete. We act &quot;as if&quot; the abstract number 5 denotes something in the same (concrete) way the picture of the apple denotes something.

A good example of how a map can distort or &quot;flatten&quot; the concrete is to think of the map of the world. When we first compare a flattened map of the world to the globe we find that the sizes of the continents are distorted, even though we have made a one-to-one correspondence between the two. Nevertheless, straight lines have been transformed to curves in the correspondence of these two representations. This is what happens when we &quot;flatten our maps.&quot;

And this is what happens when we bring these abstractions of an abstraction &quot;down&quot; from the realm of our minds into the physical, concrete world.

Thus we have completely forgotten that a decimal is not a number, but a special notation that represents a number. It is a shortcut way of representing an abstraction; it is an abstraction on top of an abstraction. It is only because we have become so used to treating all these abstractions &quot;as if&quot; they were concrete apples that we have trouble understanding what 0.999... = 1 could possibly &quot;mean.&quot; We look at this as some odd distortion as if we are looking at some flattened map of the world and complaining about the apparent size of one of the continents. It must be wrong, we say.

But we are too clever by half. We no longer even recognize our own maps as maps. When we ask, what is the color of 42, or what is the next real number, we must remind ourselves that we are talking nonsense. It is not some big mystery, it is simply undefined. We are just confused because of all of the semantic shortcuts we have taken so as to facilitate communication. The opaqueness of what we are really saying is why the mathematical rigor came into being - as a way of avoiding all this semantic sloppiness.

So when we speak of an &quot;infinite quantity&quot; we must realize that we speak nonsense; that when we do this, we speak of the &quot;abstract-concrete&quot; and make a kind of category mistake. By definition, quantity cannot be infinite. Quantity is discreet by nature; infinity is by nature non-discreet. Infinity doubled is the same &quot;size&quot; because &quot;doubling&quot; has &quot;meaning&quot; only when applied to the discreet. Just because we can denote &quot;the infinite&quot; in the same semantic form that we can denote &quot;a quantity&quot; does not mean that we can give it the same meaning. When we apply this discreetness to the idea of the infinite, we make a category mistake. In other words, we fall into the rabbit hole with Alice, asking her what nothing looks like.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What we have here is basically a semantic problem. I call it the category mistake, though I am not sure if that is literally accurate (there is a specific meaning to what philosophers refer to as a category mistake and I am not sure if I am using it exactly in the right way, but in spirit, it captures the essence of the problem).</p>
<p>From Alice in Wonderland:</p>
<p>&#8211;snip&#8211;<br />
What can you see on the road?</p>
<p>Nothing.</p>
<p>What great eyesight! What does nothing look like?<br />
&#8211;snip&#8211;</p>
<p>In these cases, we have not revealed some mystical truth or problem with the universe, we have simply made a semantic error with the usage and application of our nouns. We misinterpret or mis-state what we denote. We ask, what color is 42, what is the next real number, or we speak of an &#8220;infinite quantity&#8221; all of which are simply undefined. The reason we have trouble seeing that these latter examples are undefined is because we have obfuscated the facts of what we are denoting..</p>
<p>Here is how we get there:</p>
<p>First we are shown a picture of 2 apples (a map of a concrete thing) then 3 more apples and now we see that we have 5 apples. Then we are given another &#8220;map&#8221; that corresponds to the map (picture) of the apples. Now we see numerals next to the pictures of our apples. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5&#8230; then we get rid of the pictures of apples and deal only with our numerals (our map of a map), and with this image of an image of something concrete we slowly start to think of these numerals in the same concrete way we think of apples. We think now of the &#8220;number 5&#8243; in a very concrete way. </p>
<p>How thoroughly we have tricked ourselves! Eventually, we are unable to understand the difference between &#8220;map-ness&#8221; and &#8220;concrete-ness&#8221; altogether. Or, if we can understand it, we yet do not &#8220;see&#8221; this difference when we think of &#8220;a number.&#8221;</p>
<p>Furthermore, it is always in this way that we move from the concrete, &#8220;up&#8221; to the abstract level, and then bring the abstract back &#8220;down&#8221; to the concrete. We act &#8220;as if&#8221; the abstract number 5 denotes something in the same (concrete) way the picture of the apple denotes something.</p>
<p>A good example of how a map can distort or &#8220;flatten&#8221; the concrete is to think of the map of the world. When we first compare a flattened map of the world to the globe we find that the sizes of the continents are distorted, even though we have made a one-to-one correspondence between the two. Nevertheless, straight lines have been transformed to curves in the correspondence of these two representations. This is what happens when we &#8220;flatten our maps.&#8221;</p>
<p>And this is what happens when we bring these abstractions of an abstraction &#8220;down&#8221; from the realm of our minds into the physical, concrete world.</p>
<p>Thus we have completely forgotten that a decimal is not a number, but a special notation that represents a number. It is a shortcut way of representing an abstraction; it is an abstraction on top of an abstraction. It is only because we have become so used to treating all these abstractions &#8220;as if&#8221; they were concrete apples that we have trouble understanding what 0.999&#8230; = 1 could possibly &#8220;mean.&#8221; We look at this as some odd distortion as if we are looking at some flattened map of the world and complaining about the apparent size of one of the continents. It must be wrong, we say.</p>
<p>But we are too clever by half. We no longer even recognize our own maps as maps. When we ask, what is the color of 42, or what is the next real number, we must remind ourselves that we are talking nonsense. It is not some big mystery, it is simply undefined. We are just confused because of all of the semantic shortcuts we have taken so as to facilitate communication. The opaqueness of what we are really saying is why the mathematical rigor came into being &#8211; as a way of avoiding all this semantic sloppiness.</p>
<p>So when we speak of an &#8220;infinite quantity&#8221; we must realize that we speak nonsense; that when we do this, we speak of the &#8220;abstract-concrete&#8221; and make a kind of category mistake. By definition, quantity cannot be infinite. Quantity is discreet by nature; infinity is by nature non-discreet. Infinity doubled is the same &#8220;size&#8221; because &#8220;doubling&#8221; has &#8220;meaning&#8221; only when applied to the discreet. Just because we can denote &#8220;the infinite&#8221; in the same semantic form that we can denote &#8220;a quantity&#8221; does not mean that we can give it the same meaning. When we apply this discreetness to the idea of the infinite, we make a category mistake. In other words, we fall into the rabbit hole with Alice, asking her what nothing looks like.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Intuition Failure by Kalid</title>
		<link>http://ishangobones.com/?p=620&#038;cpage=1#comment-46</link>
		<dc:creator>Kalid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Feb 2010 12:43:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ishangobones.com/?p=620#comment-46</guid>
		<description>Hi, I just wanted to say that I love love love this analysis! I really like seeing the thinking process which is going through your head -- I think that&#039;s the heart of learning, understanding the reasons why you get from A to B, not just the fact that you get to B.

The analogy of having a static representation for 0.999... is very helpful in understanding why our intuition gets confused. We think this infinite process stops and measured, when it can never stop. Now I&#039;m starting to appreciate the 0.999... = 1 argument a lot more from an intuitive side (and not just an appeal to limits and differences that diminish below any given error margin). Awesome stuff, keep on writing!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, I just wanted to say that I love love love this analysis! I really like seeing the thinking process which is going through your head &#8212; I think that&#8217;s the heart of learning, understanding the reasons why you get from A to B, not just the fact that you get to B.</p>
<p>The analogy of having a static representation for 0.999&#8230; is very helpful in understanding why our intuition gets confused. We think this infinite process stops and measured, when it can never stop. Now I&#8217;m starting to appreciate the 0.999&#8230; = 1 argument a lot more from an intuitive side (and not just an appeal to limits and differences that diminish below any given error margin). Awesome stuff, keep on writing!</p>
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